Is it too late to do a fresh install of win7?

[m654321]

As some of you may remember, I had some problems with LL hanging at boot up in  Win8.1/LL2.8 i.e. with laptop1 in signature. This occurred either with a GPT formatted SSD (with UEFI) or an MSDOS (MBR) formatted SSD (without UEFI installed). I got the impression from someone on the forum that this problem didn't occur with a win7 or 10 dual-boot.

To test this I would therefore like to set up a win7/LL2.8 dual boot on an SSD. I have the win7 installation disk but are the updates still available? I ask this because the other day I tried a fresh install of win7 and was connected to the internet (300Mb/s) for several hours for initial updating & patching with little success - I thought updates were available until April 2019, as with LL2.8 ...

Mike

[Wirezfree]

According to MS,
Windows 7 is in extended support till Jan 2020, and you can still buy it pre-installed till Oct 2016.
So there is still some life in it yet.

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help...fact-sheet

[m654321]

According to MS,
Windows 7 is in extended support till Jan 2020, and you can still buy it pre-installed till Oct 2016.
So there is still some life in it yet.

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help...fact-sheet

Yes, that's what I thought, though I read somewhere that since 13 January 2015 Win7 support is no longer free, http://www.cnet.com/news/windows-7-support-ends-today/
Just checked the link, it says patching will continue - think paid support just refers to 1:1 customer support (e.g. phone /email support).  I did see elsewhere that hotfixes will no longer be issued - don't know if that's just rumour...

Mike

[trinidad]

MS support promises are rarely understood correctly. Any extended support for Windows 7 past October of this year, will only be for long running Professional versions, however even there many applications in Windows 7 are doomed to obsolescence; that is very little patching and kernel hardening will be available, regardless of MS announcements, and when Windows 10 approaches a half billion by the end of the year, insider hints seem to be that resources dedicated to Windows 7 will not be much of a priority for MS, actually really can't be sensibly. The Windows 7 kernel is considerably more deprecated and top heavy than you may think, and the actual updates you may need are often long gone because the patches don't always connect sequentially, so new installs from old media will not always connect those convoluted dots. It's going to be pretty self deprecating and pretty rapidly so, and new installs from old media will be next to impossible to update. Many original Windows 7 Professional systems have exceeded 80gig over their years of usage, and to expect to update such absolutely top heavy systems from an old media install is to have very unrealistic expectations considering the way MS dirties its own systems. You really should install !0, for any extended use. Don't waste your time with 7. To fully update a new 7 install done from old removable media, even if it was possible, (and it's not) could take days.

TC 

[m654321]

Many thanks for your comments, TC.
Well, that's blown a hole in my idea for doing a win7/LL dual boot till the end of the decade.
However, I'm not tempted by the pricey alternative, i.e. to buy win10 Pro (£100 to £130). I wouldn't touch the cheaper win10 HE as it's not possible to manipulate the privacy settings as much.

Looks like it's going to be an LL single boot then, with win8.1 (already have install CD) as VM guest in LL host.  Or alternatively, the other way round (LL as VM guest in win8.1 host), though that feels like heresy, as after two years I now feel like an LL afficionado! 

I have to say, hand-on-heart, with laptop (1) in signature below, it's probably the most practical and time saving solution to have LL guest on win8.1 host (I have always had many more glitches with LL than with win8.1, which are consequently  time-consuming to resolve).  I think I'm going to provoke gasps of disbelief with what I've just said... aaaargh!

Mike

PS. Did I really say that..?

[trinidad]

Hey Mike,

I'm not quite sure about what privacy differences you are referring to. You can certainly run Firefox as your default browser and Startpage as your browser homepage in windows 10 Home, and certainly proxy all you want. You can run Libreoffice for Windows as default office suite. You can easily separate Windows administration to homegroup, and leave other users without access. You can designate private network settings separate from public for safe networking. You can even run mesh and/or private ad hoc wifi with hostednetwork. There is no privacy from MS itself when you use any of their their products, but most other privacy things can be configured. Windows 7 is certainly more web vulnerable, and desktop vulnerable than Windows 10. You're a Linux user. You can get into any Windows file system you want, if the box is sitting in front of you and you have a live linux dvd, and know it or not the opposite is also true as well with certain live file managers in a base Windows rescue disk. All computers have accessible protocol accepting firmware, and disk formatted software. There is always a way in. There is no such thing as always private, just good security practices, delete key is not the same as mulit-pass zeroing, and excessively long mixed multi-character passphrases don't break in minutes on SBCs like you see in the movies, more like months and years even on supercomputers with DBs in the trillions and trillions, and in a ridiculous case like that it is actually possible to build a trojan into a passphrase and reverse the effect. MS is vulnerable across the board because they are proprietary, and refuse kernel access to their users.   

TC

[Wirezfree]

It will be interesting to see what MS does with Win7..?

Also,
Like it is/was possible to get updates to WinXP via a registry hack that made it look like WinXP Embedded
Like the ATM Embedded XP
It maybe possible to do the same with Win7, there is a Win7 embedded that is supported at least till 2020

[m654321]

Hey Mike,

I'm not quite sure about what privacy differences you are referring to.
TC

@Trinidad,
The privacy settings, I was referring to, are some you can modify when you install win10.  Not just that, but more significantly some important hacks can apparently be done to reduce (but not eliminate) vulnerability.  These are outlined in a link I posted elsewhere (see around halfway through this video, where an English guy gives a tutorial showing you  how to do this (following the 'American interview'),  https://www.youtube.co/watch?v=QEBzc1GHUQE

I attempted the above hacks (unsuccessfully) on my 'free win7 to 10 upgrade' of Home Edition in a VM last year, but it appears to only work in the Pro Edition (I remember I got a pop-up message telling me so). That's why I won't touch win10 HE with a bargepole, as it predisposes itself less to security enhancements.

I'm not as knowledgeable about PCs as yourself (that's clear) but, from what I've understood generally, the accepted wisdom is that Windows OS has pretty leaky security. However, as you know only too well, there isn't any OS that is completely secure.  'Quidsup' (a network security analyst by profession) has shown on Youtube, using win10, how Microsoft tracks you constantly on the internet in real time - the seriousness of this has to be seen to be believed - I was amazed at the scale of this. Furthermore, in his opinion, even the best antivirus/malware software is only around 20% effective, though I  think, like many other PC users,  it's better to use one (for any OS) with the caveat that some protection is better than none.  It seems to me that a significant amount of PC health depends on sensible use of the PC, e.g. avoidance of rogue websites & not clicking on malicious links in rogue e-mails. In this regard useful URL scanners can be found at the websites URLquery or VirusTotal and they are free to use - I have these websites in my web browser's bookmarks bar for quick access - they're pretty useful tools.

Regards
Mike

[m654321]

It will be interesting to see what MS does with Win7..?

Also,
Like it is/was possible to get updates to WinXP via a registry hack that made it look like WinXP Embedded
Like the ATM Embedded XP
It maybe possible to do the same with Win7, there is a Win7 embedded that is supported at least till 2020

@Wirezfree
Yes, I've been using the embedded XP (WEPOS) over the last two years (with ESET antivirus) and it seems absolutely fine - though that doesn't mean, of course, it's not infected with some sort of malware...  I still need XP as I have some temperature logging equipment that only seems to have XP drivers. I originally heard about embedded XP from English Bob (a.k.a. LinuxHelpGuy, WindowsHelpGuy) on Youtube, where he ran a very good series of videos on bringing XP backto life after April 2014, in his usual enthusiastic, amiable style.

I've just had a look on youtube about embedded win7 & there seem to be several videos on this... However, I'm not sure I'll bother going down the win7/LL dual boot now.  Seems like a lot of hassle - I think I'll call it a day on win7 & chuck the install CDs in the bin...

Cheers
Mike

[Wirezfree]

@m654321

O.K on still needing XP, do you write your own code.??

A friend of mine(who's retired) is into electronics, and writing code, he built a complete Home Control & Ventilation System, lots of A/D converters, the software was written for WinXP & 7.
He won't go to Win10, I got him hooked on Linux just over a year ago, he decided to use Mint, he's now redone all his software using Lazaruz to run on Linux, he had some issues with the A/D
stuff on Lazarus/Linux but eventually cracked it.

He's not updated his website yet, but here's a link to his "Home Control"... He started this stuff on an AMIGA, over 20 years ago...!!!. He's also done a remote version for Android.